..续本文上一页do that. It”s just like Alice saying that the heart opens and then it closes, so she has to realize that”s how it is forever and ever, She”ll get in touch and then she”ll lose touch and get in touch and lose touch. So she has to keep on going with herself and not give up on herself.

　　Question from the audience: This is really hard on her because you two are her favorite people in the entire world.

　　Alice Walker: And she didn”t come

　　Question from the audience: She”s so broken-hearted.

　　Pema Chödrön: She didn”t come because she was so ashamed of herself for not being able to stay with it...that”s not true, is it

　　Question from the audience: Yes, it is.

　　Pema Chödrön: Really. Wow. You should tell her that she”s just an ordinary human being. (laughter) What”s a little unusual about her is that she was willing to get in touch with it for even a little bit.

　　Question from the audience: My name is Margaret, and I have practiced Tibetan Buddhism for a number of years. About eighteen months ago, right around the time that for the first time in my life I fell in love with a woman, the D_Lama made a number of comments pointing out where the Tibetan tradition did not regard homosexuality as a positive thing, in fact an obstacle to spiritual growth. It reached the point that I left the sangha I was connected with and found a different part of the spiritual path that”s working for me now. I have gay and bisexual friends who are interested in Buddhism but some of them have been stopped by what the D_Lama had to say and by the lack of coherent answers from other people. I think it would be a big service if you could address that.

　　Pema Chödrön: Well, listen. I have so much respect for the D_Lama and I think that”s where people get stuck. I didn”t actually hear those comments, and I heard there were also favorable comments. But aside from all that, as Buddhism comes to the West, Western Buddhist teachers simply don”t buy that. It”s as if Asian teachers said that women were inferior or something. I mean, it”s absurd. That”s all there is to it. (applause) It”s just ridiculous.

　　Question from the audience: Let me ask you to say that often and loud.

　　Pema Chödrön: Sure! I go on record. And I”m not alone, it”s not something unique with me. Western teachers, coming from this culture, we see things pretty differently on certain issues and this is one, for sure.

　　But the D_Lama is a wonderful man, and I have a feeling that if he were sitting here he”d have something else to say on the subject.

　　Alice Walker: You know, when he was here at the peace conference he was confronted by gay men and lesbian women and he readily admitted that he really didn”t know. He didn”t seem rigid on it.

　　But also, when there is wisdom about, we should have it! Wisdom belongs to the people. We must never be kept from wisdom by anybody telling us you can”t have it because you”re this that or the other.

　　Question from the audience: I have a question about the connection between tonglen and joy, because I kind of understood the question of the moderator, anyway, Judy”s question when you breathe in so much suffering how do you avoid becoming so burdened or martyred by it, and what I”m understanding about tonglen is that there”s something kind of transformative about it, when you breathe in suffering and then you breathe out relief and healing. I keep thinking about that prayer of St. Francis of Assisi about being an instrument of peace, and where there is hatred, let me sow love, and where there is despair, let me sow hope. I”m wondering if joy has a place in the ability to make that transformation.

　　Alice Walker: I think the practice of tonglen is really revolutionary, because you”re taking in what you usually push away with everything y…

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